What the Folk!

There's been a bit of discussion about this in a few threads, and I'd just like to see what everyone's thoughts are.

As I've said before, I am of the opinion that they should leave the tv series now as is. I think it was brilliant, but I also think it's now been played out, and that is was wrapped up and concluded perfectly.
I strongly suspect that I'm in the minority with this view, but it would be nice to get an idea of the numbers of people leaning each way. This is the kind of poll you can change your votes in, so if you become swayed by someone's particularly eloquent argument, or you simply change your mind, you can re-vote (which seems pretty neat ).

Nonchalant Obsession put a great post in favour of continuing the show in the "Unpopular Opinions" thread (I think?) so she or someone else may want to bring it across here...?

I've written my own little manifesto on the topic, which I'll put in here soon...

Looking forward to seeing what you've all got to say

It's very hard for me to say I don't want a third season, because I enjoy the show so much. However, knowing what the guys went through to create this most recent season and the last, I really can't wish that kind of torture on anyone. And with all the negative feedback flying around for the second season, I can't blame them for wanting to call it quits, even though I know that's not the reason.

I voted for "I don't think so, unless they're certain they've got some really great ideas." I completely agree with that statement. If they can come up with 20 great new songs (easier said than done...) and have some funny new plotlines for season 3, then I will be sitting in front of my TV the night the new season premieres. They can't accomplish this in 6 months. It just doesn't happen. I'd like to give them 2-3 years to give that a try, with some other projects in between.

But honestly, as helgecko said, the end of the last episode seemed too perfect to tarnish with more tomfoolery. Ugh, it's so hard to decide! I will support whatever decision the guys make.

(Edit: Welcome back, helgecko! Hope everything is going well. )

Thanks raven

And yes, I think you speak for everyone when you say you'll support whatever decision the guys make.
I think it goes without saying that we'll all be massively excited to see whatever they do in the future, 3rd season or otherwise

edit: (thanks raven I'm back home now and my whole family's feeling better for having spent a few days together)

I'm reposting this long speech so, sorry to everyone who's read it before, but I'm too lazy to come up with a whole new one...

I definitely think there should be a season 3.

They have stated in interviews that the characters are loosely based on themselves and things that in some cases actually happened to them in their pursuit of success as a band.

Maybe they could let the Bret and Jemaine of the show start to get some of the same success and incorporate many of the (I'm sure) quite hilarious things that have happened to them along the way. I can just see the "North American Tour" episodes. The guys invited to swanky parties with celebs. TV commercials, (cell phones - Outback) Um, maybe a few movie deals? How would they grapple with actually having money?

There are so many genre's to parody, so many ridiculous people to poke fun at, Australians to mock, so many new fantastic comics for them to showcase, so much to learn about NZ and so many people who enjoy the show. We must all make a lot of noise to HBO so that they offer the guys a great deal to return.

I know it was hard work for Bret & Jemaine, but I love this quote: A person speaking to the artist Renoir who continued to paint despite great, physical agony, "Why do you go on and torture yourself like this?" Renoir looked at the canvas on which he was working and replied, "The pain passes, but the beauty remains."

Another great quote from the movie, "Shakespeare in Love": "The Master of the Revels despises us all for vagrants and peddlers of bombast. But my father, James Burbage, had the first license to make a company of players from Her Majesty, and he drew from poets the literature of the age. We must show them that we are men of parts. Will Shakespeare has a play. I have a theatre. The Curtain is yours. "

Oh, I know I'm being very dramatic but I feel like FotC is something of a masterpiece.

It is very true that they will not vanish without a season 3. They are both so talented and I truly look forward to their solo projects, (they can do both) but their work together is really something special. That unique relationship that we all witnessed on stage, the music that they create together, the genius of the comedy produced - we can't let that slip away!! I swear they will go down in as one of the most (maybe the 4th most) popular comedy duo's in history. Take your time Bret and Jemaine, as much time as you need. But come back to America and make a Season 3!

C'mon guys. Don't give up the dream. We want more.

thanks nonch, I was hoping you would

edit: my thoughts...

The tv show is a very small part of Flight of the Conchords. FotC have existed now for over 10 years, and the show is really just a side project from what they’re really all about. Just because it has received the most exposure of anything they’ve done, that doesn’t mean it’s the best or most important thing. I believe that what they do best is what they set out to do, write brilliant songs and perform them live in front of audiences.

I think that, as brilliant as it is (and it’s very brilliant), the show actually sells them short in some ways. The characters that they’ve created and they play don’t let their real personalities shine (which, of course, is a credit to their acting) like their live shows do. The professionally recorded and mixed versions of their songs often lose something in the translation (many people feel this way about Bowie, for one). And also, I think that they wrote and recorded songs for season 2 that wouldn’t usually be considered good enough to classify as Conchords songs (eg Love is a Weapon of Choice, there’s not much to it without the video). I’d much rather hear 5 new songs from them of their usual quality than 15 new songs that are “good enough for the show”.

I personally can’t stand the thought of them doing the 3rd season in a different situation (eg with them being famous, or in a different location) to the first two. The whole aesthetic, situation and “universe” that the first two seasons existed in were absolutely integral to the show “working” and being as funny and charming as it was. So much more than being able to think of funny scenarios or one-liners was the reality that they existed in.

The show is about being underdogs in the world (being from NZ), being underdogs where you live (being poor in NYC), and being underdogs in the music business, and yet still maintaining a sense of self and dignity (or not ). The fact that they are tiny little fish in one of the world’s biggest ponds gives poignancy and heart to every moment of the show.

And there’s the simple fact that failure is funny and success is not. A season that involved the Conchords (of the show) becoming successful would be an entirely different show. It would be an uplifting dramedy about perseverance *retch*.

Basically, I think the scenario they worked with for the first 2 seasons was absolutely perfect, with wonderful supporting characters and a down-trodden feel that suits their dead-pan humour perfectly.

I ALSO think they’ve played it out. I think the scenario and universe they created was perfect for them, and it was limited (as everything is, really). I think they’ve done the best they could possibly do, it was utterly brilliant, and it was concluded amazingly (and heart-wrenchingly) well.

Part of creating a masterpiece is knowing when to lay down the pen or the brush (or the omnichord…) and step away, happy with what you’ve created. And they should be happy.

As I said at the start, the tv show is really just a side-project, or after-thought, of what FotC is all about, B & J have both made that clear a number of times. They never set out to create it, and I imagine they will continue on as they always have done after it’s finished. I think they should get back to writing songs for the amusement of it and the joy of the process, rather than “because they need one for episode x”.

There’s any number of other things they could work on together as well.
Those wonderful aliens the guys played in the Drinky Crow Show made me think it would be so wonderful if the guys did some other little show together, but not really under the Conchords “banner”. Some little low-budget NZ-based thing... perhaps incorporating Jemaine’s claymation…?

Anway, that’s just my two cents.
*cough* ...blame the exchange rate…

I'm voting for "I don't think so, unless...", though having said that, nonchalant obsession's argument for season 3 is very well put.

I just think that there'd be nothing worse than the show running out of steam after two such fantastic seasons. I don't think that it definitely would run out, and I'm not doubting B&J&J's abilities, but the formula of the show is a risky one to stretch out for another 10 or 12 episodes. (Also, I kinda think that the longer Bret & Jem are in America and the more that happens to them, the less plausible (even in sitcomland) and/or funny all the scraps their naivety gets them into. I'd hate for it to become trite.)

It could only maybe work, I think, if they shook things up a bit, which is what I think non-ob is suggesting with the idea of the boys actually achieving stardom. This could be funny (hell, anything they write has the potential to be funny), though Gervais' Extras did get there first, and also on a stupid selfish level I don't know if I could deal with Bret and Jemaine not being scruffy naive underdogs anymore. We've already got famous successful Conchords; the show is for their crap goingnowhere alteregos.

Having said that, daydreaming about the possibilities of S3 still makes me a bit excited. But I'm happy with two seasons, and I think they capped it off really nicely. If they announced season three, I'm not such a cynic that my reaction would be a dubious one, but again, there's nothing worse than two fantastic seasons followed up by anything less than another fantastic season.

Bring on a new project, I say.



edit: Just read hel's post above mine - Hel, I agree with pretty much everything you've said, particularly...

1. the bit about how this TV show is a side project and not necessarily their number one offering. Anything represented visually through mainstream broadcast is bound to become much more famous than, say a live album, but it doesn't mean thats what the Conchords are.

2. some of the songs getting lost in translation - yes yes yes, I thought I was alone in thinking this! I've never enjoyed their music as much as when it's live - in fact my adoration for One Night Stand and Folk the World was the reason I resisted the HBO show for so long.

(obviously I havent worked out how to quote people yet...)

thanks Bikkits. Glad I'm not just talking crap

Well, that too.

Can someone tell me that the hell this is meant to be?! -

Oh, wait, I get it now. /facepalm

Ha!

I voted for the "I don't think so, unless..." option as well. I wrote a little blurb in the Unpopular Opinons thread, I'll copy it over here:

On the topic of season 3, if I really think about it, I don't think I want one either.
At first I did, because I couldn't imagine life without new FOTC episodes. I was astounded when people expressed the view that they didn't want another season.
However, after thinking about it...season 2 ended so PERFECTLY. It would almost butcher that perfect ending if they did a season 3. Of course, if they do end up doing one, I'll certainly still be happy and watch every episode with devotion, but if I really think about it, I love the way it ended and don't want that perfect ending to be skewed in any way.

To add to that, I agree completely with what others have said so far. I think if the Conchords focus too much on the TV show, then their entire concept will get lost. The main thing that the guys have always done is live performances. However, if they keep doing this TV series, then I think people may get too attached to the TV show and lose interest in the live stuff. Not only that, but I think it's the TV show that has really given them their huge recent fame. I almost don't want them to become any more famous than they currently are, because I find it was almost better when fewer people had heard of them, as they had more freedom to do what they wanted. Now, with such a large fan base that is a direct result of the TV show, they're probably feeling a lot more pressure to have to do the show, which they should not have to go through.

As for the idea of the songs being better live than the TV versions, I think that's true as well, but it's not a large concern of mine. Of course, I think the Conchords songs were written to be live, so they will always be better in a live situation. Having said that, I don't mind any of the TV versions of the songs, and I think the guys actually did a good job of making changes to them that weren't too dramatic. And yes, this means Bowie, which is my favourite song, and I don't really mind what they've done with it for the show. Sure, it's quite different, but I think it's actually not bad, and the guys did a good job translating that song to the show.

A final thing is the time pressure. Part of the reason that some people (not me, but others) believe that season 2 was lacking was because the guys didn't have enough time to write and fully develop their songs. Although I didn't have any problems with the music of season 2 at all, I can understand why others would think this. It's hard enough to write songs as it is, and to be put under the time constraint that the guys were is really asking a lot of them. I can only imagine how much more amazing their songs could have been if they hadn't been under such pressure to write them. Not to say that I have problems with any of the S2 material (I don't, I loved it!), but I get the feeling that the guys may have had more in them than they had time to show.

In any case, I would fully support a season 3 if it happened, but I can't say I'd be disappointed if there doesn't end up being one. The guys should feel free to do whatever they want, and I hope that in the future they will take on new projects seperate from the TV show, such as writing new live material and eventually touring again.

Aaahh, so I hope that long explanation made sense...it's hard to make your opinons sound coherent unless you're in your own brain!

Brilliantly said, helgecko. The last 5 minutes of the last episode pretty much said series finale....but one must not give up hope. Maybe with some well deserved down time and no time crushing filming constraints from HBO, they can get their thoughts and ideas together, and probably in the distant future, give it another go, but IMHO I think a longer format, either an hour long special or a full length feature film could showcase more un-edited songs (Jenny, Stana, Bus Driver Song etc...)and be a great comeback from the lads we all love!

I agree. The only way I'd want more is if they were able to do a Christmas special like they joked about - and if it was as good as the UK Office Christmas special.

I really like the live concept. Another HBO live special would be a great thing.
Also, I'd hope they would write some movies together not using themselves as the main characters.

This is a great thread Helgecko. Cause you all are helping me understand where you are coming from.

But seriously, I wouldn't even know who they were without the TV show. Nor would I have probably ever seen any of the amazing comedians that they have worked with.

How will we get more "music videos"? Lines to quote? Screencaps?
Not to mention Dave, Mel, Murray, Greg, Doug???

Nope, I'm not ready to give up. I know none of you underestimate their ability to come up with a GREAT idea for S3. (not my lame one suggested above) Yes, there is a time to quit and this may be it. But I really hope not. I think they have so much more to surprise us with. Some critisized S2, but without it we would not have Sugalumps!! Pepileptic Dogs! Unnatural Love!! What other gems could be created because of the evil american machine HBO?

Those are my quickly assembled thoughts, now back to work.

I put "yes definitely". Probably, not the most popular opinion. I just really do think they could keep it going. I think if it is loosely based on themselves, the show could actually take a turn as to where they DO become popular and successful, and I would imagine they would have a whole bunch of material to work with around that. I don't know, everything they've done in my view has been brilliant, so I can't imagine them doing it poorly.

That said, I also have watched the interviews etc. where they explained how much work it takes to do this kind of show, and I also wouldn't wish that torture on anyone. So, my feeling is maybe if they were motivated to do it, that would be great, but I can completely understand if they called it quits. (I'd be sad, but I'd understand.)

I voted for the top option.

People are saying it would take too long to write new songs. They have:

Hotties
Stana
Nothin' Wrong
Bus Driver's Song
Who Likes to Rock the Party (full version)
Robots (full version)

That's 6 songs for them possibly to use. I think if they worked on the series for as long as they needed to and weren't at all pressured by fans/the media they could produce an excellent 3rd season.